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Discussion in 'Clockwork Empires General' started by Nicholas, Sep 19, 2012.

  1. dbaumgart

    dbaumgart Art Director Staff Member

    We don't want to play up this idea of digging too much. Every bloody game nowadays is a digging sim of one sort or another and we're not focusing the design on that aspect of gameplay. In short, there won't be an extensive multi Z-level digging simulation like Dwarf Fortress because, basically, this game is about insane Victorians, not Dwarves. I assure you though, your people will get up to all kinds of interesting things ...
     
  2. mining

    mining Member

    Can there be an amusing digging reference explaining why No. Digging. Is. Allowed.
     
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  3. Lorrelian

    Lorrelian Member

    Semi-related idea: It might be interesting if the Crown simply makes certain areas of activity Off Limits in a given scenario. Not that you can't do these things, just that it would get you in some kind of Trouble if you did.

    Like on one mission you can't research digging tech, or engage in any mining. In another, you can't have airships, which causes trouble when the Mind Controlling Jellyfish Gods come and start making colonists kill each other. That kind of thing, forcing players to improvise, or loose prestige or just rack up disciplinary counters until they are quietly removed from office and called back for a stern talking to.
     
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  4. mining

    mining Member

    I like this so much that I need to make it clear that I like it more than a 'like'.

    :upvote: :upvote: :upvote: :upvote: :upvote: :upvote: :upvote: :upvote: :upvote: :upvote: :upvote: :upvote: :upvote: :upvote:
     
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  5. Kamisma

    Kamisma Member

    That's what I assumed, but then there was this story which was mostly about digging with an oversize drill (and finding a symbiotic obleskian coffin underneath), hence I was confused.

    So if such a drill were present in game, it would just be some kind of building producing ores, junk, and occasionally some mysterious artefacts, but you wouldn't get to see what happen underneath, basically ?
     
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  6. Marak

    Marak Member

    So. Who else is trying to throw money at their monitor every time a Clockwork Empires scenario/story is posted? Seriously, I think they rival StarkRavingMad's episodes of Boatmurdered, and I felt guilty enough getting that for free.

    I realize this game is still in like, pre-pre-pre-alpha, but if you can nail even a little bit of the "losing is fun!" and "these elements combined to do what!?" in the actual game, it's going to be next Dungeon Keeper and I (and many others) are going to love it pieces.
     
  7. Kamisma

    Kamisma Member

    Dungeon keeper ?

    Nah.
     
  8. Marak

    Marak Member

    Well, that's the vibe I get from this game. Obviously it's going to be different, but the genres and sense of humour are - to me, at least - similar.
     
  9. Kamisma

    Kamisma Member

    Clockwork seems to be more sophisticated dark humor than "hohoho we are the evil guys doing the evil things", I mean no disrespect to DK, after all it was a good game, but i don't find many similirities with CWE in the spirit.
     
  10. Marak

    Marak Member

    Not sure why you're arguing with me over this. I'm hoping that it'll give me, personally, a DKII vibe, since that game is still one of the best I've ever played (even if the GoG version crashes constantly and irritates the hell out of me).

    Your mileage will vary.
     
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  11. Kamisma

    Kamisma Member

    Arguing for arguing's sake, there not so much activity around here ;)
     
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  12. Sightedjt

    Sightedjt Member

    Hmm, Im intrigued by the possibilities of various eldritch artifacts that may be found, such as the ominus coffin of shiveringhopes.

    Im kinda curious as to how they will be generated.
    Best idea ive came up with as to how it might work is that certain activities have a chance of discovering strange objects, as well as sometimes being present somewhere on the map.
    The object can be studied, revealing various properties about it.
    So stuff like- Upon attaching to a building, it will do X if conditions Y are met
    So Will produce steam power but slow down function of building provided people are present in the building for the sanatorium obelisk in one of the posts.

    But there will be hidden properties, such as increased accident chance, people caught in steam can become cultists or possesed, etc.
    These properties will not be revealed by the initial examination, and will only manifest after a period of time has elapsed.
     
  13. Wootah

    Wootah Member

    So I finally got around to reading the monstrous blog of doom about Shiveringhope. Good read and good storytelling.
    It did leave me mentally in a place that I seem to come across alot when it comes to Clockwork Empire.... a place where my conceptions of the game don't match what is being described in the least.

    This time it has to do with scale and character density. The shiveringhope mine had 20 people mining in it. In my minds eye, that seems like a TON considering each character has a huge list of characteristics the engine tracks to produce interesting interactions. While 20 alone isn't absurd, that is just the mine. How many people are working in a 'factory' I sure hope it is more than 1-2 per factory. How many factories are in a developed town? Given the size of the characters in the screenshots vs the size of the buildings it doesn't look like you could fit many characters into these buildings, but there was that blog post about how the door frames weren't matching character size. Don't take this as a complaint. I am happy that things don't fit. Very few video games that have the isometric view have properly sized buildings.

    But I guess what I am getting at, how big would be the 'ideal' size community? How big was it in Dwarf Fortress (where you didn't have to animate each individual? How many people fit/use buildings like factories? Is it going to be small, like say, 4-6 or more like our modern (or even industrial age) factories that would have hundreds?
     
  14. Triskelli

    Triskelli Member

    After about 8 in-game years you can expect a good +200 dwarves in the current version of Dwarf Fortress, even though each industry will only require a handful of dwarves dedicated to it. I imagine colonies in CE will at least get up to 100 colony members, and likely more than that.
     
  15. dbaumgart

    dbaumgart Art Director Staff Member

    Ah, this is something we've discussed!

    In playing DF I observed that I would only really keep track of a certain core 'cast' of characters -- the first 7 dwarves, for sure, and then a few more that stood out as exceptional. It capped at maybe twenty or so dwarves who had any real identity to me. Once the fortress got to 50+ they were all kind of an unmanageable amorphous mass of dwarf.

    To deal with this we want to try to cut down the core 'cast' to, yes, about 20 or so characters that the player will actually pay close attention to. We do this with the class structure & the notion of specialists. Basically, the lower class is treated as a faceless mass of labour pool (as is only appropriate in the Victorian / industrial revolution era) while the middle class forms the key pieces of the player's colony -- managers, overseers, engineers, scientists. This middle class forms the bulk of Company Agents who carry out player orders. So rather than telling some labourers to cut down trees, an overseer will collect some labourers to cut down trees. Rather than having to keep track of ten lumberjacks, you keep track of one lumberjack overseer who can have more or less labour assigned to his command as necessary to supply the lumber you need.

    (The upper class, on the other hand, exists mostly to be a pain in the ass. Much like DF.)

    I really ought to make a blog post about this.

    As for buildings, yes, we abstract the interiors and have a stylized sense of scale.
     
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  16. Lorrelian

    Lorrelian Member

    Just a random question on class mobility: Will we have to handle our urchins carefully to guard against the possibility that they will become best-selling authors, move to the upper class and make our lives a living hell? Or will people pretty much be stuck in one class for the whole scenario?
     
  17. dbaumgart

    dbaumgart Art Director Staff Member

    I suspect we'll be open to class mobility. Why, when the upper crust of a colony is offed all at once by brain-eating squids, all sorts of Opportunities open up for Industrious and Enterprising Subjects of the Queen to better their Station in Life and Find Fortune and Glory (For The Empire). Pip pip, etc.
     
  18. Triskelli

    Triskelli Member

    Any devlogs this week, or is the office busy voting today?
     
  19. Wootah

    Wootah Member

    They are in Candada...
     
  20. Loren

    Loren Member

    Pshaw! Canada has elections to, silly. :p