I think the Wand Lore tree should effect , instead of .. For two main reasons: One, for me at least, wands seem to be more useful for rogue builds than wizard builds, and it even provides melee/ ranged damage towards the end of the tree. Two, it doesn't make sense that it would improve your raw magical power ( / ), but your magical skill ( , lower cost). If you are using wands, it would seem like it would make you more efficient with other spells, since the Wand Lore tree is all about using your wand's / charges efficiently. Edit: I didn't even realize that I played right into Dredmor's particular joke about wands.. I would edit it out, but the fact that it was accidental makes it that much funnier ^^
Most of the effects from wands are boosted by magic power iirc... what Wand Lore really needs is better late game wands.
Perhaps it should give both then? Because as far as I am aware no skill only a few skill trees seem to give alot of .. Also, I thought 5 points of is only like 2.5 extra .. Maybe raw could replace the (which also effects ). Edits are blue
Does it? You must mean 5.. but yeah, there is only that and the last skill of Magic Training. There definately seem to be more skill trees that buff (or add abilities that directly affect) / / than trees that buff .
He's including Savvy for putting points into a rogue skill. Rogue and wizard skills give 2 Savvy per point.
I didn't know exactly how stats scaled with rogue/ warrior/ wizard points.. Anyways, I don't see how that proves why the Wand Lore tree should only buff / / rather than , or both.
I think what they meant is that the only savvy in using wands is knowing what they are supposed to do (as savvy is supposed to be wisdom stat). Actually knowing how to use them effectively is something you'll get from sagacity (which is supposed to be intellect stat), as with limited charges you aren't supposed to learn how to use half a charge at once, but how to use that one charge at once to benefit yourself the most (thus what is important is overpowering the effect, which normally comes from sagacity).
Something to boost alchemy and smithing to reflect tinkering's boost to trap bonuses? For example Alchemy could be something like: - "All those times you've been drinking strange and mysterious concoctions have somewhat made you more resistant to noxious mixtures, +1 resist to toxic." - "Ooof, almost fainted! These fumes are dangerous! Don't breath this. Your regular exposure to noxious gazes has, against all odds, hardened you against choking fumes, +1 asphyxiative resist." - "Curses! Another acidic compound, you've managed to burn yourself again! Strangely enough, it doesn't hurt as much anymore, maybe your skin's become more resistant? +1 resist to acidic." Similarly, for smithing: - "Ouch! Hit your finger again with your hammer! But it definitely doesn't hurt as much as it did the first time, your hands seem to have gotten use to the abuse, +1 crushing resist" - "That's not a hammer that you're holding, but hours upon hours of hitting metal on metal is a hard habit to break, your attacks feel heavier, +1 crushing damage" - "Egads! Your clothes are on fire again, it took even longer for you to notice than the previous times. Slag and fire has become so common place when smithing, you sometimes forget it's dangerous, + resist to conflagratory."
I do like those.. although perhaps only for the creative descriptions ^^ Anyways Kazeto, I do have to disagree with that logic, but there is hardly any point in arguing something this subjective back and forth anyways.. Even if you were right about that, it would still be nice if it gave you some extra , since even in your example, was useful for Wand Lore.
Tried the little lockpick mod out and the game crashed when I attempted to craft some lockpicks. I'll poke at it and see if I can fix it myself, I'm curious if there's a way to mod the lutefish cube into storage containers, so will see how much I can learn by poking at stuff. Edit: I'm searching the game's itemDB.xml for Lockpick and not finding it. I wonder if that particular item is hard coded into some dll or executable? There is a graphic for it under the items directory...
You know what I think, that it's strange that the Alchemist tree doesn't even have metal transmutation as a skill, w.t.h. I mean it's pretty much exactly what alchemist are knownfor, it's there freaking namesake! I mean you got your Aqua regia and your Gold Solution (which does lolnothing), but the one thing Alchemists were most reknown for, metal transmutation, isn't in the game!
I don't think Demonologist is contradictory. Well, it is, but it's *meant*. You study from a little to quite a bit of demonology, and you can protect yourself against de demons, and are pretty reliable with sacred rituals/are on the side of the Good Pawah (the righteous resist) You study too much, and become a minion of teh devulz! (oh noes!)
It's pretty easy to become contradictory. I actually had a character (a well-developed one, and to the very end he was actually acting on his motives and character traits) in a tabletop RPG (a home-made one that isn't available for masses, but that is irrelevant) campaign who started trying to stop his grandfather from dying. As the time passed, his goal shifted from doing that to trying to prevent another war, which he attempted to do by going on an assassination spree (and yes, it made sense for him in-character, as his psyche got pretty wrecked in the process, meaning he was willing to go much further to achieve the same thing, at the end getting into situation when he was willing to do something very bad to stop something "just" bad from happening). And the same happens in real life, because humans are too much of determinators, and are too curious.
I guess I really should have written more, and been clearer about what I felt were "contradictions" with the Demonology skill tree.. I didn't just mean that it didn't make sense, but: From a flavor perspective you were selling out to gain power, a bit similar to the Necronomiconomics skill tree. From a gameplay/ mechanics perspective, that this would be the strongest warrior/ rogue skill tree, but would have alot of risks. You don't really get that much power from the end of this tree, and you don't get that many downsides, so I don't think it really fits its theme mechanically or thematically.. I would really like to see one of 3 changes, I will write more about these after the summaries. 1: It would be changed so that the last 4 tree levels give alot more benefits, but have a bigger downside than just - . 2: That it would be split into two trees, that both have unique mechanics and themes about demons. or 3: A combination of the two split tree's mechanics, since they are similar. For the first example, I would really like to see a general buff to the existing abilities, and maybe a few new activated abilities that have downsides after being used.. it would be a bit similar to Necronomiconomics. As an example, maybe you could use a very powerful melee attack, but then every melee attack after would be weaker. Also, the theme that "you are selling your soul to gain power" really needs to be emphasized in the mechanics, randomly turning into a demon, with massive debuffs certainly doesn't help the theme.. For the second example, I would like to see two types of trees: Someone that studies demons, and uses their own power to make him/ herself stronger (utility tree), with the risk of messing up and taking damage/ debuffs; and someone that has made a pack with demons, and gets stronger abilities at a straight cost (would be more powerful of course). The "priest", since I really just want something to refer to the tree as, would get 1 - 3 per skill level, but this would be used to resist your own effects. Every ability that you would use would debuff your for x turns (stacks alot), and if your is ever low enough, you could be cursed, might turn into a demon (effect would be worse at higher levels), and as a demon you would get melee power, but everything else would be debuffed (same as current demon debuffed form, but not random, its a consequence instead..), along with other negative effects. This tree would be quite strong, and could be themed for mages, or rogues very well, with lots of useful effects. The "cultist" would lose every skill level, and would get alot of abilities that would directly increase your stats like rage, and other activated abilities that would have huge side effects. This tree would probably be pretty similar to example 1, with lots of strong abilities, with straight downsides, this would be warrior/ melee themed nicely, with high damage/ stat effects. These two skill trees could easily thematically be combined, and since their mechanics are a bit similar, it would probably work quite well, with adjustments ofcourse for any contradictions. I would really just like to see any buff to the tree, it doesn't seem like you are getting very much power at all, honestly it doesn't even seem like an offensive tree, but a utility tree.. which would be completely fine if it wasn't for the "turning into a demon for power theme". Edits are blue
Well the thing is, balance-wise, Demonologist is already arguably overpowered because of Celestial Circle. In order for them to buff the rest of the tree, CC needs a considerable nerf. I'd also argue that getting yourself silenced on a random proc IS a pretty hefty cost for your points in Demonologist. I do think some power does need to be shifted to the later parts of the tree though but I'm not sure how to do this without gimping melee because they're pretty reliant on CC atm.
